From: yaniv_vi_at_yahoo.com
Date: 2001-07-15 07:37:01
hi
first ,when i do temp bfb i usualy can get to around 96.6F -97.1F
there is a reason to try for more ?
i feel somewhat relaxed , but it's not such a unique thing-
i can meditate or just calm myself down to get to this , i think .
so maybe for this bfb i don't need .
but again - for most people - how usefull is temp bfb, how much it
attracts people to bfb ? what the change most people experience after
this ? is like that's the first time the feel the relaxtion response
or know how to go there ?
what prevent temp bfb becoming very popular ?
many question , but i hope theyle be useful
sincerly yaniv
--- In buildcheapeeg_at_yahoogroups.com, peterson_at_d... wrote:
> --- In buildcheapeeg_at_yahoogroups.com, "frans" <f.smith_at_c...> wrote:
> > Hi,
> > Temperature Feed Back.
> >
> > Lets asume the temperature of the human body is
> > 37 degree's Celsius. A to high temp. would be fever.
> >
> > Raising only one or two degree's celsius could be done,
> > but it works slowly. GSR for example react fast.
> > From all the bfb methods temp. is the slowest.
> > One can use temp. with succes, but the problem is dat it
> > works slow.
> >
> I think that temperature is very much underrated as a biofeedback
> procedure--not just by you, Frans, butr by many professionals in
the
> field as well. True, temperature responses are somewhat slow, but
> that can actually be an advantage. If the instrumentation doesn't
> pick up every fleeting change and orienting response like EDR does,
> they are less distracted by the equipment and seem better able to
> focus on the relaxation process. People in relatively high anxiety
> states often start out with fingers at (or only slightly above)
room
> temperature (~20 C). To get from there to 35 C is pretty
impressive,
> and because the electronic thermometers read in 0.10 degree
> increments, they get a lot of feedback about even very small
> temperature changes. In my experience, it takes about 6 to 10
> sessions of training before people learn to reliably get to the 35
or
> 35.5 degree criterion. I have had really wonderful clinical
results
> with these simple devices in many cases. At the AAPB convention in
> Denver, Dr. Pat Norris (daugher of Elmer Green, a pioneer in EEG
> biofeedback, who with her husband Steve Fahrion has done a lot of
EEG
> biofeedback work) presented a whole session on temperature
training.
> She ties it in with a variety of approaches including Assagioli's
> psychosynthesis. Also, Gene Peniston (originator of neurotherapy
for
> addictions) always uses temperature training in the first few
> sessions before putting his patients onto the EEG equipment, partly
> because it helps them to see the connection between mind and body,
> and partly because it helps prepare them for the alpha-theta
training.
>
> Get a cheap thermometer and try it. You may be surprised--but make
> sure it amples temp every couple of seconds like the Harbor Freight
> ones do, or like the ones commonly sold especially for biofeedback
> do. Biomedical Instruments sells a special biofeedback thermometer
> for about $20 if you want something a little fancier than the
Harbor
> Freight version I mentioned earlier.
>
> A therapist must convince a client he/she can control his/
> > her body. At least some parts of it.
> > If this would take to long, then the client would not be
> > building confidence. A qiuck prove that one can influence
> > one's body-processes gives client confidence.
>
> In my experience, people do learn to change finger temperature
quite
> easily and quickly. They almost always start getting useful
results
> in the first session, and these are only 15 or 20 minute sessions.
> >
> > Temp, is used in anxiety. There is some illness where
> > people suffer from bad blood circulation. Raising the
> > temp, in an given area can improve the condition.
> > A higher body temp. at a given location indicates more
> > blood circulation. Only logic then to use temp. for con-
> > ditions where you need to have better blood circulation.
> >
> > In my opinion Temp.FB, is only important in the above
> > conditions, and for experiments. In autogenic training people
learn
> to relax, raise the temp. of arms and legs etc..
> > If you would try this you would notic its easy with arms and your
> feets. But if you try to raise the temp of any
> > onther part of the body it would be not that easy.
> >
> > For example, in mind-control class, i could feel heat in my
> > feets and lower legs, and in my hands. Notat the top of
> > my head, or in my neck....To become more sensitive to
> > other parts of the body temp.FB is ideal. But again, it
> > works slow.
> >
> > EEG can be used for depression sinds some wave patterns correlate
> to depression (according to rechearch).
> > GSR, Temp, ECG, EMG, are only physiological reactions
> > due to some problems like fear, stress etc...
> >
> > Most BFB learn us to react different to events, social or
> > psychological proplems. Controlling our reaction to some
> > event makes that a event does not control us anymore...
> >
> > F. smith
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: peterson_at_d...
> > To: buildcheapeeg_at_yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Saturday, July 14, 2001 6:04 PM
> > Subject: [buildcheapeeg] Re: Software requirements
> >
> >
> > --- In buildcheapeeg_at_yahoogroups.com, yaniv_vi_at_yahoo.com wrote:
> > > hi
> > > 1. about my goal - it was just to design the s.w. with some
> option
> > > that in future it could be used for bfb/nfb . just not to do
> the
> > same
> > > work twice in the future . i know it delays in some when open
> > source
> > > s.w. is ready but , we have some nfb soft and second it's the
> right
> > > way to work .
> > > 2.about bfb , there's on type of bfb that is very simple to
do -
>
> > > hand temperature biofeedback. the tools are cheap and
> availble
> > > - a simple digital thermometer .but still it's not very
used
> > > technique . why ? can anybody start working on this area ?
> > > because to some extent i think the same things that prevent
> > > nfb from bein popular , and the same things that prevent
> thermal
> > > bfb from being popular .
> > > and i think if we do some serious work on making thermal
bfb
> > > popular we have a stronger base for making nfb popular .
> > > it might be very helpfull to our goal (giving the power of
> nfb
> > > to public) .
> > > 3. on a personal note , could someone write a serious note on
> > thermal
> > > training ? because i have started on this , and i have a
> few
> > > questions , like for example what temp should i achieve ?
> > > what techinques can i use to achieve lowe temp ???
> > >
> > >
> > You're absolutely rightr about the value of temperature
training,
> and
> > the cheapness of the equipment. Actually, I use it a lot
because
> the
> > equipment is so cheap that one can do it in groups, with an
> > instrument for each participant. You can use almost any
> thermometer
> > that you can hold in your fingers, such as a glass alcohol
> > thermometer with an exposed bulb you can grasp, but I buy
simple
> $10
> > indoor-outdoor thermometers from Harbor Freight
> > (www.harborfreight.com). You switch the thermometer onto
Outdoor
> and
> > hold the end of the probe with the thermocouple between your
> fingers.
> > These are good thermometers because they sample temperature
every
> > couple of seconds. Many other I/O thermometers, like the ones
> Radio
> > Shack sells, only sample every 10 or 15 seconds and that's too
> slow
> > for feedback. We generally try to get people up to 96 F (35.5
C)
> > finger temperature. To accomplish this, you can use many
> approaches,
> > such as listening to a progressive muscle relaxation tape or an
> > autogenics tape. Or just keep repeating to yourself words
> > like "Soft, warm, heavy, limp" (limp as in loose, free of
muscle
> > tension) and trying to increase these feelings in your body.
> >
> > Hope this is helpful.
> > Jim
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> >
> > >
> > > --- In buildcheapeeg_at_yahoogroups.com, peterson_at_d... wrote:
> > > > --- In buildcheapeeg_at_yahoogroups.com, "frans" <f.smith_at_c...> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Hi Yaniv and other members,
> > > > >
> > > > > I was thinking of a MODULAIR BFB/NFB SYSTEM.
> > > > >
> > > > > *Computer interface including .
> > > > > * Module 1, EEG for neurofeedback.
> > > > > * Module 2, ECG
> > > > > * Module 3, GSR (very effective for anxiety)
> > > > > * Module 4, Temperature FB.
> > > > > * Module 5, EMG
> > > > >
> > > > This is an absolutely fascinating idea. I think most of
the
> > > > biofeedback equipment on the market is grossly overpriced,
> and if
> > > it
> > > > were more commonly available a whole lot of people would be
> > better
> > > > served. This would by no means reduce the need for
> therapists,
> > who
> > > > would be able to keep themselves very busy as "coaches."
One
> > very
> > > > interesting new area is heart rate variability (based
either
> on
> > > > EKG/ecg or on a finger pulse sensor), which seems to be
> important
> > > in
> > > > reducing the potential for heart attacks, etc. The process
> of
> > > > learning to increase your heart rate variability apparently
> > > involves
> > > > learning to be less angry. I don't really understand the
> whole
> > > > psychophysiology of it, but there is a website,
> > www.heartmath.com,
> > > > that I think some of us might find interesting to check
out.
> > > >
> > > > Nevertheless, I really hope these side excursions do not
> distract
> > > us
> > > > from accomplishing our main purpose of developing the
openEEG
> > > system.
> > > > --Jim Peterson
> >
> >
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> >
> >
> >
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