From: frans (f.smith_at_c...)
Date: 2001-08-11 00:56:29
----- Original Message -----
From: SKYFLYER
To: buildcheapeeg_at_yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, August 10, 2001 10:46 PM
Subject: Re: [buildcheapeeg] The cheapest biofeedback device
However, I believe NFB can do the most to bring people into the state of pre-enlightment.
* enlightment means one is not bound to earth or material things anymore.One is free from
the physical world witch operates under maya (cosmic illusion). Also, enlightment is the
result of years of training. There where yogi who lived all there livesalone to find it, an yet
they did not came that far. Enlightment means also one has reached thehighest under-
standing.
* Pre-enlightment ???, you realy think this could be done with NFB, only because you would
use NFB to reproduce the brain-patterns of a master ? Where then is thew knowledge ?
where is the xperience ??...experience comes from years of meditation etc..
* A normal man has not even knowlegde of his owm sub-conciousness, not even knowlegde
of his own body, not to say, knowledge and skills. I have two eeg's, i can train my-self in
theta, but would i then think different of material stuff ?, would i not like female anymore ??
would i posess knowledge......i think not...
*Before you think its possible, read and learn about the occult schools. also learn about the
eastern psychology......
*NFB/BFB can help us in meditation, can tell us the state of mind...but even then, it does not
make us free from maya, cosmic illusion.
*It is a fact however that -for example- the theta state can give some interesting effects like
visions, oobe (out of body experience) etc... problem is only that somepeople reported
fearfull images etc.. whe enter our sub-conciousness and whe cannot understand what is
stored in the sub-conciousness.
To be enlightened, extra kick is needed.
What kick ???... to be enlightened one must have deep knowlegde and skills and understand-
ding...earned afther long training...
In the sixties they thougth taking drugs would be the same.......only because they got those
strange effects..(hallucinations)....to my knowledge, none of them becameenlightened.....
Today they think using nfb would be the same, or using sound (braintapes)........
People do experience different effects like a feeling of peace, some fear, visions etc...
but that no enlightment....
The best thing whe could do is use nfb/bfb to free our self from mental/physical conditions.
Some scientist believe its all in the brain (ganzfield ?)...whe can produce effects like fear-
full images by stimulating parts of the brain, and a lot more effects...so sience believe whe
could understand enlightment. But enlightment is about the thruth. All the material things
are just an illusion. My body, the world, all illusion... How then can material stuff give us
enlightment ??? when in fact our mind and thougths create matter ???
During NFB training sessions, people needs to be remined in a certain point that this is exactly the state of pre-enlightment. i.e. if the training is effective. And methods would be given to keep their mind in that state even when they are not using NFB.
*what is "exacly the state of pre-enlightment ??" a theta state ?, or a brain-pattern witch looks like that of a master ?.
People's will power is the key to achieve that state, not NFB. NFB wouldact only as the meter to our state of mind. So, training method is still the most important element in NFB.
*will power works against any form of relaxing or meditation, for it demonstrates resistance.
To my knowlegde every body reacts different. For example in alpha one isrelaxed but research shows some
people still have fear in alpha !!!!. Therefore an EEG is very personal.
Training is important, but i don't think Samadi would be the result.
I would very much like to see the invention of a wireless EEG that peoplecan carry with them anywhere they go just like a walkman. And it would report the state of mind anytime you wish. To do this, a lot of studies needto be performed.
* why do you have to carry an EEG ???, under normal conditions you would probally show beta-waves.
As for the EEG, measuring brainwaves without wired electrodes is a must. Is it possible to get readings from wireless earplugs, earclips or even body media such as saliva or hair samples?
*you mean telemteric systems. It is possible to do so, but not cheap. In fact one must wear a headband with
electrodes and electronic stuff to send signals to the main instrument (like a walkman). also if you would
like to monitor lets say a day, then you must in some way record all the data. Would be that expencive no-
one could afford. (al least not in the first comming ten or 15 years).
regards.
Frans
----- Original Message -----
From: frans
To: buildcheapeeg_at_yahoogroups.com
Sent: 2001/8/11 03:12 am
Subject: Re: [buildcheapeeg] The cheapest biofeedback device
Hi,
I think you do not understand the difference between an brain-pattern/state
and a state of "conciousness".
NFB can help in meditation, but i think
you cannot just copy the patterns of a
goeroe or master.
It would be to complex to explain for me
sinds my englisch is not that good, and
also i had to do some study on it, but i
think you must understand that a yogi
afther years of training has an inner
feedback system. The fact that he can
alter his brain waves is not the same as
people like us do afther some sessions.
In one session a goeroe holding his had
above the head of a man, was able to
change the patterns of that man.
They used the mind-mirror.
The awakened mind.
ISBN 90 202 4919 3
Delacorte Press/Eleanor Friede, New York.
Alpha brainwaves.
David Boxerman and Aaron Spilken.
1975. ISBN 0 89087 016 0
Biofeedback.
1972, Marvin Karlins, Lewis M. Andrews.
J.B Lippincott company, 521 fifth
avenuem new york, new york 10017 usa.
ISBN (netherlands) 90 257 0162 0
Regards
Frans
P.s
Do you think an enligthed man has a
special brain pattern witch can be imi-
tated by normal man, and at that moment they are enligthened ???
Is the special brain pattern a result of the fact that this man is enligthened, or
is being enlighted a result of brain patern ?.
You realy think by having the same brain
patern you would be enlighted ?.
so from that moment on you have a form
of higher conciousness ?.
I think this is not the case, but if it would
be that simpel, the world would be a different place.
Frans
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